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Raspberryjam View Drop Down
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    Posted: 07 January 2011 at 9:59am
http://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/top-stories/8607663/autism-and-vaccination-link-elaborate-fraud/

thought this might interest some
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cuppatea View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cuppatea Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 January 2011 at 10:10am
Someone else already put it in the news bit.

Is important to remember it was just one study

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lucky apple Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 January 2011 at 10:32am
Originally posted by two_boys two_boys wrote:



Is important to remember it was just one study



...with only 12 participants.....


ETA: the word "only"

Edited by Sally
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cuppatea View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cuppatea Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 January 2011 at 10:59am
Yep well that's what I mean, one study that only said there was a possiblity of a link, it didn't claim there was a link, that only looked at one side effect of one vaccine doesn't really change much does it. It's hardly the huge big deal the media are making of it.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kellie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 January 2011 at 11:31am
I agree with two_boys. I don't know if there is a link or not but one study is hardly going to sway me one way or another

Edited by kellie

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote karenb_chch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 January 2011 at 12:41pm
The point is that this is the study that everyone quoted to link the MMR vaccine and autism. It resulted in vaccination rates in the UK dropping from 95% to 80% in less than 10 years. And it was a fraud.

There are NO reputable studies, that I am aware of that link autism with any vaccine.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote freckle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 January 2011 at 12:50pm
Originally posted by karenb_chch karenb_chch wrote:

The point is that this is the study that everyone quoted to link the MMR vaccine and autism. It resulted in vaccination rates in the UK dropping from 95% to 80% in less than 10 years. And it was a fraud.

There are NO reputable studies, that I am aware of that link autism with any vaccine.


Exactly! and there is a lot of evidence negating any relationship between the two, i.e. early brain differences (prior to the MMR) in children diagnosed as ASD. The fact the many ASD children begin to show more overt characteristics of the disorder (or begin to regress) around the age MMR is administered, appears a mere correlation and in no way indicates a causal relationship, as this is the typical presentation of ASD no matter whether vaxxed or not...
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cuppatea View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cuppatea Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 January 2011 at 1:16pm
Well these people were awarded 1.5 mil for a vaccines causing their child autism like symptoms, and other cases of autism have been paid out in the past

http://www.cbsnews.com/8300-31727_162-10391695.html?keyword=hannah+poling

Wakefield didn't tell people not to vaccinate he said concerned parents should use the single vaccines instead which at the time were still currently and readily available, it was the Uk government that in the same year made the single vaccines unavailable forcing worried parents to pick whether to give the MMR which was relatively new at the time or not vaccinate, so the UK government was responsible for the decline in vaccination if fingers are going to pointed at anyone. (and I'm not saying what wakefield did was right, I'm just saying that he never said don't vaccinate the Uk government forced parents hands)

Also there is this that shows that measles outbreaks actually dropped as the vaccination rate drop

http://www.vaccinationnews.com/measles-united-kingdom-wakefield-factor

I don't know either way if any vaccine actually causes autism but my intial point stands this is only one doctor, one study, one vaccine and yet the media and pro vaxxers seem to think that all people that have chosen not to vax should run and get them done just because of this, which is silly, decisions not to vax aren't based on one research paper, the same as a link or the possibility of one also wouldn't be based on just one paper.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote linda Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 January 2011 at 3:34pm
two boys, I think you'd be surprised at the number of people that would take that one report as being the 'truth' and basing there decisions on it. The fact that it is a fraud will hopefully make other people research that much harder to work out the so called best decision for them


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shezamumof3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 January 2011 at 4:18pm
I personally dont think vaccinating has anything to do with autism, I think if a child is going to develop it, they will regardless, its in the childs makeup, and nothing to do with vaccinating.

And if someone is anti vaxxing, then I also dont think they should have to run out and vaccinated cos of this one study. If someone chooses not to vaccinate, Im asuming they have done a lot of reasearch on the matter.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nicandtyler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 January 2011 at 5:03pm
as a non-vaxxer my reasons for not vaxxing weren't due to the threat of autism. Yes that thought crossed my mind, but I have done so much research on the topic that that is not something that worries me, there is plenty that I researched that put me off vaxxing (which I won't discuss on here lol) but the autism and vaxxing debate is one thing that bothers me a bit cos its what some people around me seem to think is the only reason I have chosen not to, when it's not at all.




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rorylex View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rorylex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 January 2011 at 9:32pm
well my son has autism and he didnt start showing signs til well after his vax. so i dont think they are linked.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote myonlineself Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 January 2011 at 11:55am
the thing is - that study did so much damage and really started off the whole anti-vaccination thing and caused a huge drop in vaccination numbers for what was total and utter rubbish - and now evidence suggests in fact a deliberate fraud.... the damage that study caused will never be completed 'fixed. Even if people now don't use that study as a reason not to vaccinate, it did cause many many people not to at one time, and is still directly or indirectly a cause of people choosing not to vaccinate.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raspberryjam Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 January 2011 at 12:40pm
Well I dont know one way or the other, but I am happy with my decision to vaccinate as I believe the chances of adverse affects are no where near the chances of infection without vaccines.
I do think the scare tactics the media and dishoesty surrounding this issue has caused much damage too
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Emmecat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 January 2011 at 7:30pm

Originally posted by linda linda wrote:

two boys, I think you'd be surprised at the number of people that would take that one report as being the 'truth' and basing there decisions on it. The fact that it is a fraud will hopefully make other people research that much harder to work out the so called best decision for them

I would be suprised at this Linda...and disappointed if people chose not to vax simply due to ONE paper/item of research. I know many parents who don't vax their kids (and many who do) and of those who don't, none of them have based their decision on this paper.  My choice to not vax my children had nothing at all to do with this paper or the 'threat of autism'. I guess everyone has different reasons though. I'm sure there are pro vaxxing papers/research studies which are just as much a load of bollacks as this one was


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kebakat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 January 2011 at 7:56pm
Originally posted by linda linda wrote:

two boys, I think you'd be surprised at the number of people that would take that one report as being the 'truth' and basing there decisions on it. The fact that it is a fraud will hopefully make other people research that much harder to work out the so called best decision for them


I agree with that. There are people out there who hear things like that and thing OMG I'm not doing that.

Its the same as when some people hear blah blah blah may cause cancer or something like that and they immediately avoid anything related to it like the plague without really researching it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hopes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 January 2011 at 8:24pm
I know someone who is dead set against vaxing because it 'causes' autism. This study caused a real scare when it came out - I can understand that, because if something like it came out now, I'd re-think vaxing (as it was, when I made my decision, more studies had been done since this one which suggested that, surprise surprise, there wasn't a link).

Not that I agree with her thinking; a little more research would have done a world of good. But she's living proof that it persuaded some people.

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Raspberryjam View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raspberryjam Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 January 2011 at 8:24pm
Originally posted by kebakat kebakat wrote:

Originally posted by linda linda wrote:

two boys, I think you'd be surprised at the number of people that would take that one report as being the 'truth' and basing there decisions on it. The fact that it is a fraud will hopefully make other people research that much harder to work out the so called best decision for them


I agree with that. There are people out there who hear things like that and thing OMG I'm not doing that.

Its the same as when some people hear blah blah blah may cause cancer or something like that and they immediately avoid anything related to it like the plague without really researching it.


sadly there are! after many years working in pharmacy you would be surprised at what people buy or dont buy due to myths and ledgends or keeping up with the jones's
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hopes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 January 2011 at 8:29pm
I know, it always amazes me what people buy into without checking it out.

In saying that, I'm guilty myself. I religeously drank grapefruit juice (which I hate) every month to increase EWCM, even though I couldn't find a study anywhere which suggested it does actually increase it. Although I guess at least I was aware it was most likely an old wives tale... but I figured it couldn't hurt

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Buttersmum Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 January 2011 at 8:40pm

I blame the media for alot of these reactions to things as well.  Unfortunately they pick up on these small studies some that aren't even concluded and exagerate the side effects or focus on one possible side effect or outcome.  Its scaremongering and unfortunately alot of people believe what they hear/read. 

I've seen it so many times regarding cancer studies and HRT studies.  Makes me so cross


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