Coffee Catchup 23rd September - Lower Hutt

Hi I would strongly recommend not weaning him that is not the answer and also as you are a working mother it is the only thing that you can do that others cant.

I would suggest getting a NUK first feeder cup and for every meal offer say 30 mls of milk in it. Eventually he will learn to drink from it. But you need to take the time and be consistent with him.   YOu will pick up the cup and hold it for him. Also for his drinks before nap times again I would offer him milk out of a cup. The bottle to try is the evenflo bottle with the basic teat, however as he is 9 months old I wouldnt bother with the bottle.

As long as he is getting a good balance diet from the care giver I would not worry about his milk intake.   Also during the day when you are working it would be important to offer him sips of water but only sips.


Add on - I also meant to say after reading my answer that you only wean if that is what you want to do and not what others are suggesting.

Edited by DorothyW - 29 September 2013 at 8:25pm

HI Okay this is how I would see his daytime routine working with the emphasis of putting on weight and having good sleeping habits. As your son is 3 months is ideal awake times will be approx. 1 1/2 hours to 2 hours. Also ideally he is feeding every 3 to 4 hours during the day. Remember if he isn't feeding during the day then he needs to feed during the night.   If you add his awake time and nap times this should totally approx. no more than 4 hours, so if he feeds at 7.00am his next feed (latest time) would be 11.00am.

7.00am Wakes
7.15am breast

8.45am Top up -Breast feed (important as the gastric emptying of a breast fed baby after 120 minutes is 16 to 18%)
9.00am Nap - minimum 1 1/2 hours resettle if he wakes (wakes 10.30)

10.40am Breast

12.15pm Top up -Breast
12.30pm Nap - minimum 1 1/2 hours resettle if he wakes (wakes 2.00pm)

2.10pm Breast

3.45pm Top up - Breast feed
4.00pm Nap - minimum 1 1/2 hours resettle if he wakes (wakes 5.30pm)

5.40pm Breast

Evening routine, bath, breast, bed

7.30pm Bed for the night

Night waking resettle, resettle,

WIth your current feeding routine during the day it is important he has his night feeds as he is not feeding regularly during the day. IF you fed him regularly during the day then you could resettle during the night.

I have written Breast in the above routine, however it can be formula. I would tend to do formula for the top ups if you were concerned he wasn't getting enough.

Yes, he does well for being up but being overtired in the day wont help with putting on weight and also getting the feeds in during the day.

Hope that helps

Hi I tend to start with the self settling and once happy with that then move into the resettling. I have attached the notes on settling and resettling earlier so let me know if you need any more information.

While teaching him to self settle when he wakes to resettle I tend to get in there straight away and start the cupping. I don't really give up as it takes approx. 20 minutes in my experience to find their sleep so to self settle and resettle it will take about the same time. So in answer to your question do you get them up and try later the answer is not really. If they don't settle in the cot then I do it in arms and again for the resettle.

I would take away the white noise, feeding to sleep - although it is important to feed him before going to bed. I tend to do a feed approx. 15 minutes before naps and nighttime and then swaddle and then into bed.

Don't start anything in arms that you cannot do in a cot so avoid the jiggling and also transfer to the cot before he is asleep if you are going to do it in arms. The goal is to sit still and just engulf him for approx. 20 minutes, if he doesn't fall asleep then intervene with cupping.   ALso although I mention 20 minutes it can be less than this.

Yes there is always a cap on how long you take to settle and resettle.    I tend to cap it around the 45 minute mark, however some babies take longer and some less. Ideally It is around the 20 to 30minute mark.

Well done on the change - love having happier babies and happier mums.

So the evening routine would look similiar to this

5.00pm Dinner , breast, bath, breast, clean teeth, bed

She could also possibly want more food - solids so I would mix cereal with vegetables and see if that helps.

You also mentioned that she would peak and drift to nothing but never stop for longer than 5 minutes. To me this is her going to sleep pattern and probably after 20 minutes to 30 minutes I would have stayed in the room cupping her to sleep.    She just couldnt get there on her own but it will come. If this is resettling during the night then it is important to stay there until she falls in a deep sleep. And yes you will think you are there and as soon as you head for the door she will wake so then you go back and continue until you can come out of her room.    

Hi until you teach him to self settle and resettle during the day naps you cannot expect him to suddenly do it at night.   A lot of babies are good sleepers to around this age and then start waking - it can be due to big developmental steps, hungry and needing solids, teething and sometimes when they are sick. As you are cuddling him to sleep this is not a problem as long as there is no movement involved and you are giving him the right to find his sleep before intervening with cupping.    At some stage you will probably want to try to settle in his cot so the step here is to have him in arms for a certain amount of time and then put him in his cot for the remainder of the time it takes to get him to sleep.   Then once you are comfortable with this then you would put him into the cot drowsy and go from there and eventually the next stage would be awake into his cot. These steps will not happen overnight but will take some time.

As he is over 8 months he needs food before milk so I would suggest that his first feed of the day be his solids.    If he wakes before 630am then you need to resettle or leave to play in his cot happily.

To avoid the head banging on the sides of the cots I would recommend using the air vent wrap mesh bumpers - these are sold from various baby stores


air wrap mesh bumpers - depending on what time of cot you have depends on whether you buy the 2 sided warp for cots with solid ends or the 4 sided wrap for all sides .

One of the theories about night waking is as follows for babies aged 10 months plus:

There is one theory that night waking or early morning waking is due to babies/toddlers looking for that first milk feed of the morning. It’s like they are ‘excited/crazy’ to have that sucking time. Sucking is also their way of comforting themselves and so they feel the need to do this to resettle during the night.

If you take away the first milk feed of the morning and replace it with solids then after a few days (maybe up to 10) your baby should wake a little later in the morning or not so much at night because the ‘sucking’ on the milk has gone and at the same time your baby can learn to find different ways of self settling.

Some believe it’s a kind of ‘maturing’ or moving onto their next milestones going from “sucking” to eating food and drinking from cups.

I have attached a toddler routine for you to look at and adjust this to suit your family

2_naps_Toddler_general_guideline_Wgtn_.pdf

Hi this is normal for number two's and it take time for toddlers to be encouraged to do a poo on the loo.   I tend to encourage them to ask for the nappy pant when they want to do a poo so that they feel okay about this. As she goes away to hide, I would suggest that she puts a nappy pant back on then and over time she will learn to do it on the loo. A further step is to put the nappy pant on and encourage her to sit on the toilet - some toddlers feel safer this way.

Everyone will have a story on how they taught their children to do number 2's but it is about taking the time, being consistent, and calmness around this.    Forcing or disciplining doesn't work, however some other suggestions are a reward system, books, dvd's - all relevant to doing wee's and poo's on the toilet.

If you are concerned re this then I would suggest a visit to the GP or Ped and talk it through with them.

Not wanting to wear underwear - does this matter she is only little. The more you make an issue of it the worse it will become.   I have seen little girls take their knickers off in public and run around without them. She will at some stage learn to leave them on.    

Ways to encourage is mummy wears knickers, or gosh your bottom will get cold or chilly with no knickers on. Buy her favourite character knickers and this sometimes encourages them as well.    Encourage her to put them on herself.   

If she insists she doesn't want to wear knickers then dress her accordingly ie. leggings, longer dresses.

Toddlers often like to mimic their parents so do knicker dressing together and also does she see anyone else do poos on the toilet - demonstrating is a good way to encourage them.

Hi by having a routine that is flexible it does not restrict you from going out and doing what you need to do. What it does do is it teaches your son how to self settle and resettle at the times he is meant to be sleeping while you are out and about.

I have always encouraged babies to have a moving sleep and a concrete sleep (cot) but these are always within 1/2 an hour of the times that i would like to work with.   Routines are about being flexible and babies thrive on knowing what is happening next.

If you teach your baby to self settle and re settle it means that when you are out and about and come home he can then be transferred into his cot and he will resettle himself. Once he comes out of the capsule and is in a rear facing carseat you will be unable to take that inside for him to continue sleeping so ideally now   is the time to teach him to resettle.

Not sure why he is 4 weeks away from solids as solids start between 4 to 6 months depending on the individual baby. I find that most babies start somewhere between 5 and 6 months. I take each case individually and work with the baby and I also take into account the weight of the baby. I have posted notes on introducing solids and vegetables earlier in the forum so you may like to have a read of them. Again once you start solids you will need some routine in his life so that he is eating breakfast, lunch and dinner at certain times of the day - again i work within 1/2 hour either side of the time that I would ideally like them to be at.

WIth regard to moving his times to an earlier time the answer would be that he would sleep the same length of time so he will be sleeping for approx. 8 to 9 hours so if you put him to bed earlier he would sleep the same amount of time but is getting his sleep before midnight which as we all know is the better sleep times.

A routine for him would be as follows - you will need to adjust the times to suit your family life but the consistency is his awake times and nap time

7.00am Wakes
7.15am Breast (this will also be his breakfast time once he is on three meals a day)

9.30am Breast
9.45am Nap (I am working on a minimum of 1 1/2 hours) 11.15 he wakes

11.30am Breast

1.45pm Breast
2.00pm Nap

3.45pm Breast

Option here is either do the evening routine and he will be in bed for the night by 6.15pm - which is what I would do

or you can give him a band aid nap of approx. 20 to 45 minutes so that his evening routine starts around 6.00pm and he would be in bed for the night by 8.30pm - which is late but once he drops it and his awake times for the day stretch to 3 hours and he is having two naps of minimum 1 1/2 hours he would be going to bed a lot earlier.

I would tend to resettle in the night which is what you are doing, the difference is that if he doesnt find his sleep I would then go in and cup him until he goes back to sleep.    Feeding to me is the last resort during the night for this age group.







Edited by DorothyW - 29 September 2013 at 10:16pm

Hi a typical routine for a 5 month on solids would look similiar to this
7.00am Wakes

7.15 am Breakfast - cereal mixed with milk, option to offer fruit - ratio I use is 1 tablespoon of cereal to 1 teaspoon of fruit, Breast to follow after leaving the highchair (I tend to wash and dry face and hands, wipe highchair, rinse plate and then offer breast)

9.15am Breast
9.30am nap (wakes 11.00am)

11.30am Lunch - vegetables, followed by breast milk

1.15pm Breast
1.30pm Nap (wakes 3.00pm)

3.30pm Dinner - cereal mixed with milk, followed by breast

evening routine - bath, breast, clean teeth, bed

OR again the option is to offer a band aid nap late afternoon of approx 20 to 45minutes so that the dinner/evening routine starts around 5 to 6pm. This nap will be dropped once her awake time stretches to 3 hours.

You mentioned you fed 4 hrly but if your baby was only sleeping 45 minutes then you would add that together with her awake times and that would make her feeding times so I am assuming her awake time is 3 1/4 hours and napping for 45 minutes which would make for a very tired baby.

Edited by DorothyW - 29 September 2013 at 10:29pm

Here are the notes on how to settle and resettle 0 to 12 weekers
ohbabywellington_0_to_12_wks.doc